News
Scoreboard
Events
Demos
Downloads
Galleries
Forums
June 19th, 6:45pm UTC+0
LIVE - de_dust2_se
Na`Vi
12
2
14
fntic
3
2
5
• ESEA CS:GO Season 14 - Europe
Jun, 19 08:00PM
fntic
-
-
-
ESC
-
-
-
TV posted when available
• ESEA CS:GO Season 14 - Europe
Jun, 19 08:00PM
VG
-
-
-
NiP
-
-
-
TV posted when available
• ESEA CS:GO Season 14 - Europe
Jun, 19 09:00PM
K1CK
-
-
-
Anexis
-
-
-
TV posted when available
• ESEA CS:GO Season 14 - Europe
Jun, 19 10:00PM
Na`Vi
-
-
-
NiP
-
-
-
TV posted when available
• ESEA CS:GO Season 14 - Europe
Jun, 19 10:00PM
Epsilon
-
-
-
ESC
-
-
-
TV posted when available
• ESEA CS:GO Season 14 - Europe
What to Watch
    Upcoming Events
    Site Poll
    ESEA Invite Week 3.1 (de_dust2): Frost Gaming or Global Revolution ?
    Frost Gaming
    Global Revolution
    Recent Discussions
    Content

    Are Molotovs Overpowered?

    B "Few" S on Thu, 10/18/2012 3:24PM
    Written by Josh "steel" Nissan

    In the long anticipated arrival of CS:GO, we have seen the inclusion of many new "features" into the game. Some of these features were desperately needed, others not so much. Included in the newest features were the creation of two new grenades, the molotov/incendiary and the decoy. But what do these grenades do for competitive play? Are they good or bad? Should we welcome these additions?

    I think the molotov grenades should be disabled from competitive play for several reasons. The current competitive rule set of 15 round halves, 1 minute 45 second round time, and the money system have all been refined over several years to be a
    The radius of one moltov
    standard in competitive Counter-Strike for over half a decade (hold for CGS which had a plethora of issues itself). Basically, no matter how you want to argue that it is simply a change in meta game or whatever other debate you want to stir up, in order to include such a drastic game-changing element into competitive play, you must first have a total overhaul in the current standardized league settings. The molotov would not only require these changes to bring balance to the game, but this change was not brought in with competitive play in mind. The molotov grenade was added by the developers to be a fun new addition to the game to attract new gamers and "spice it up".

    To balance the molotov grenade without addressing any league settings, the damage output needs to be lower or the slow effect needs to be removed. It is too powerful in its current state where it damages AND slows in an area of effect. The molotov can single-handedly thwart an aggressive attack from the Terrorist team, or can remove a Counter-Terrorist from controlling an area for close to 10 seconds. Now, before people start arguing that a smoke grenade or flashbang have a similar effect at a fraction of the cost, they need to understand that a player can turn from a flashbang to avoid it, or still listen for footsteps. A smoke grenade can be abused, peeked over, pushed through etc. Enjoy avoiding a spread of flame across the floor that is both visually and audibly distracting. Seriously, try it.

    With the molotov, Counter-Terrorists have a fail-safe way of stopping a rush tactic from the Terrorists on every map. Think about de_nuke where you have an upper rush, or de_dust2 where you have a catwalk rush or de_inferno where you have a
    A CT can eliminate a B SPAWN advantage for Ts with ease
    B rush or apartment/middle rush. A single molotov can stop an entire team from attacking the bombsite which gives the Counter-Terrorists enough time to set up in their spots and prepare for a delayed execution. The reason why rush tactics are so powerful is because working off of spawns, timings and brute force. An entire Terrorist team can bust through the Counter-Terrorists defense before they have time to be set up in proper positions. A Counter-Terrorist who is sitting on the rafters above hut on de_nuke is going to be much more of a threat to Terrorists than a Counter-Terrorist who is still running across in the open until he gets to his spot. The same thing applies for Counter-Terrorists who are playing on de_dust2 at A bombsite, or even B bombsite; if a Terrorist team rushes fast cat through speedway/darkspot, then a single molotov can hold off the attack until the Counter-Terrorists get set up. Over at the B bombsite, a player can throw a molotov which will buy a player enough time to get to the back of the platform behind the headshot box where he is completely safe from flashbangs.

    The defensive team will almost always have the advantage of the molotov, unless the bomb is planted. Sure, a terrorist can
    The smoke covers you
    throw it into a spot to "smoke out" a Counter-Terrorist to make for easy pickings, but it won't always work. The bombsite is big enough that if you don't throw it perfect, you've wasted your money. On de_mirage a T quickly rush short B and help prevent fast rotates by throwing a molotov into the window or the connector, but its not a surefire security blanket. With the update that makes molotovs explode in midair, any offensive advantage that molotov's had was virtually erased. The hefty investment for a small chance at actually being able to be used
    The fire makes it easy
    effectively makes it one of the most useless items available to the Terrorists. The terrorist instead must rely on the newest addition, the decoy grenade. While it sounds like it could be a trade-off, the decoy grenade doesn't do damage, and it really doesn't distract anyone, especially if you can see it. The blatant advantage for the Counter-Terrorist team is enough reason to remove it, let alone all other aspects.

    If a team picks up enough momentum, they can easily secure themselves the rest of the half just because of this powerful grenade. A team that is down on rounds loses the capacity to run faster strats or even fake strats with the molotov in the game. If a CT team plays 4 players A, a single player can hold off the Terrorist from falling back and hitting B by using one molotov which can buy his teammates ~10 seconds to rotate back to the B bombsite. This makes the game less skill-based and way more momentum based, spiraling off of the initial pistol and following eco rounds. In a team-based skill oriented FPS like Counter-Strike, all elements of luck should be reduced as much as possible; both teams should be on an equal playing field every "weapon round".

    When you look at a game like DOTA2 or HoN, you can see how much of an effect one player can make on the game if they get far enough ahead on level or farm. CS:GO isn't an ARTS game - it is a team based FPS. Changes that reduce skill and increase randomness and accelerated momentum without being thoroughly balanced and changed over time threaten the potential of both the game and competitors severely. For these reasons, molotovs in its current state should not be included in any events until it has been properly balanced.
    Comments
      
    Actions
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:27pm #1 SPYTE
    nice article!! i like the shots XD
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:30pm #2 nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want to fly around the map fragging go play quake.
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:31pm #3 Few
    Referenced post #2 by nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want... to fly around the map fragging go play quake.Read More
    #2

    why even have rotating spawn points then? the idea is to give the T's different situations to use tactics. Rushing on an upper spawn is nothing but tactic oriented. Thats why when you don't have it you play more passive...

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 3:32 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:31pm #4 IKSnicur
    Referenced post #2 by nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want... to fly around the map fragging go play quake.Read More
    #2
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:36pm #5 medicc
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:41pm #6 rmZ
    agreed
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:46pm #7 SPAMMER
    ah fk it just remove em.
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:51pm #8 JMPR
    I kinda agree with most points. They shouldn't be removed IMO but make them do damage without slowing down. Having the option of running through them (like a smoke as stated in this article) makes it way more balanced, as the thrower still needs to stay on his toes and not just hide and be assured that nobody will rush his site for a good 10 seconds.

    And we're not even talking about stacking fires on top of each other or one after another.
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:52pm #9 nickerfoo
    Referenced post #2 by nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want... to fly around the map fragging go play quake.Read More
    #2

    So what you're saying is, you can't handle a rush without a molotov. OK, just checking.
     / · 10.18.12 at 3:55pm #10 CSGOfuckyourself
    I really liked the Molotov at first, but they are getting very annoying. I agree with his points.
     / · 10.18.12 at 4:04pm #11 Rich
    Referenced post #2 by nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want... to fly around the map fragging go play quake.Read More
    #2
    lol


    Even outside of invite most teams already have a slow as fuck terrorist side just to prevent aggressive cts and ecos

    JUST REMOVE THESE FUCKERS

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 4:05 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 4:23pm #12 messiaH
    Reduce damage by 50% of what they are now, then re-evaluate.
     / · 10.18.12 at 4:27pm #13 Sh3nl0ng
    Referenced post #12 by messiaH
    Reduce damage by 50% of what they are now, then re-evaluate.
    #12

    Remove slow effect & keep damage where it's at, then re-evaluate. Or do both. But removing slow effect is important.

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 4:29 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 4:38pm #14 demos
    I think the molotov is fine in its current form, but I understand the positions of people that have issues with it.

    Personally, I welcome the change to the game and all the new aspects it brings.

    It honestly does not last that long and is fairly expensive anyway. Terrorists can use molotovs to their advantage as well. When taking over a chokepoint or advancing, throwing a Molly at certain spots can eliminate the need to cover that spot and hasten the time it takes to take position over an area.
     / · 10.18.12 at 4:57pm #15 phroxen
    "A CT can eliminate a B SPAWN advantage for Ts with ease" LOL? Spawns positions are the same, only thing that changes is the person order.
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:06pm #16 jolieistrash
    ttyl molly

    you're hot and all.. but we've really got to end this

    http://memecrunch.com/image/4edca42f1861...


    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 5:08 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:11pm #17 virulent
    agree with all points!
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:12pm #18 maGnum
    sounds like a cry baby article, but from said player, it should be expected.. It's not hard to out play a molly.
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:13pm #19 steel-
    Referenced post #18 by maGnum
    sounds like a cry baby article, but from said player, it should be expected.. It's not hard to out play a molly.
    #18
    You completely miss the point of the article.
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:23pm #20 moderN
    Referenced post #2 by nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want... to fly around the map fragging go play quake.Read More
    #2

    Have you ever watched a demo from AZK? On both CT and T if he gets a good spawn that leads him to choose when and where to awp a certain side.

    Sure AZK is still doing well but a simple herp chuck a molly shouldn't eliminate the excitement of a good spawn for one person, or half of the team for a rush.

    Maybe it's a small thing for you, but the small things add up in invite.
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:34pm #21 rmZ
    Referenced post #19 by steel-
    #18
    You completely miss the point of the article.
    #19
    http://i.imgur.com/biXlr.gif
     / · 10.18.12 at 5:53pm #22 secLusion
    My initial feeling was that I liked them. I've played a lot of different games competitively, so I'm more receptive to change than most. With that said, the more I play GO competitively, the less I like them. If they stay in, I'll manage -- with that said they are a huge advantage to CTs. Like the article says; they don't have much use to Ts unless the bomb is down.

    Sure you can molly something to make sure CTs don't push through it, but unless you immediately run away (which they'll hear) it's pointless.

    My biggest issue is against most teams, once they get money you can all but forget about rushing against them. There will be fire waiting for you every time. In a lot of cases we're talking 2 or 3 of these. By that time, your delayed rush has become a non-rush and CTs have enough time to get map control in several positions.

    Anyway, I'm not necessarily saying they should be removed -- but they probably need to be changed somewhat. If they're taken out, I think I'd be okay with that as well.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:07pm #23 derdian-
    the best part about the decoy grenade is my 2 teammates were using it at banana and he threw a decoy at sandbags while the t's were rushing it and the t's just ran by seeing the decoy not caring, when in reality the other guy was sitting behind sandbags and he killed them all rofl
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:11pm #24 MKP
    Referenced post #18 by maGnum
    sounds like a cry baby article, but from said player, it should be expected.. It's not hard to out play a molly.
    #18

    sounds like you didn't even read the article
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:11pm #25 POWERHOUSE-
    i support the molotov.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:13pm #26 nya
    Referenced post #2 by nelluc
    your advantage of the round shouldn't be based off your spawn points... molys slow down the game just enough and bring a new playstyle that bring the tactics back to CS.

    if you want... to fly around the map fragging go play quake.Read More
    #2 Exactly the problem with this community, if this game was named anything but Counter-Strike the economy would be fine, the molotov would be fine, people would adapt to it just fine. The fact that it is a Counter-Strike game though somehow negates all logic and if it's not the same as it's always been it's blasphemy.

    The molotov is fine, there's too much dumb in this community...

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 6:16 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:27pm #27 steel-
    Referenced post #26 by nya
    #2 Exactly the problem with this community, if this game was named anything but Counter-Strike the economy would be fine, the molotov would be fine, people would adapt to it just fine. The fact that... it is a Counter-Strike game though somehow negates all logic and if it's not the same as it's always been it's blasphemy.

    The molotov is fine, there's too much dumb in this community...
    Read More
    #26
    That is incorrect. That would be a game similar to Counter-Strike, something like oh I don't know... Call of Duty?! The fact of the matter is that it was part of the Counter-Strike Franchise and it is an imbalanced weapon.

    Valve could have made a game called Unicorn Stampede and if it contained all of the elements of CS:GO then people would naturally assume it is a still-developing version of Counter-Strike just because the maps are the same, the economy system is strikingly similar, etc., etc.

    The thing is that I like the current weapon recoil, I like the m4 and the AK, and I like the custom maps (mirage, inferno_ce, train_te) but the fact of the matter is that the game has not been balance tested with the molotov. The economy system has not been balance tested. The issue is not "we should remove the economy system" or "we should make it exactly how it was in CS1.6/CSS" but rather "we should spend considerable amount of time tweaking the current systems in place to make sure that it is competitively viable".

    The molotov is not fine "in its current state". It needs to be balance tested. It has already undergone several changes (range, bounce, explode mid air) and it will undergo several more. It should not be used in competitive play until it is ready for the competitive environment. End of story.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:31pm #28 nya
    Referenced post #27 by steel-
    #26
    That is incorrect. That would be a game similar to Counter-Strike, something like oh I don't know... Call of Duty?! The fact of the matter is that it was part of the Counter-Strike... Franchise and it is an imbalanced weapon.

    Valve could have made a game called Unicorn Stampede and if it contained all of the elements of CS:GO then people would naturally assume it is a still-developing version of Counter-Strike just because the maps are the same, the economy system is strikingly similar, etc., etc.

    The thing is that I like the current weapon recoil, I like the m4 and the AK, and I like the custom maps (mirage, inferno_ce, train_te) but the fact of the matter is that the game has not been balance tested with the molotov. The economy system has not been balance tested. The issue is not "we should remove the economy system" or "we should make it exactly how it was in CS1.6/CSS" but rather "we should spend considerable amount of time tweaking the current systems in place to make sure that it is competitively viable".

    The molotov is not fine "in its current state". It needs to be balance tested. It has already undergone several changes (range, bounce, explode mid air) and it will undergo several more. It should not be used in competitive play until it is ready for the competitive environment. End of story.
    Read More
    #27 Man we already went over this, the fact that you even need to defend your position in the face of an article like this written by yourself is just dumb. I don't care what you think, you don't care what anyone else thinks, it doesn't matter.

    Newsflash mr. professional gamer, Counter-Strike is an ASYMMETRICAL game, every version and iteration.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:33pm #29 steel-
    Referenced post #28 by nya
    #27 Man we already went over this, the fact that you even need to defend your position in the face of an article like this written by yourself is just dumb. I don't care what you think, you... don't care what anyone else thinks, it doesn't matter.

    Newsflash mr. professional gamer, Counter-Strike is an ASYMMETRICAL game, every version and iteration.
    Read More
    #28
    Holy fucking brick wall
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:34pm #30 2Say
    Yes.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:37pm #31 nya
    Referenced post #29 by steel-
    #28
    Holy fucking brick wall
    #29 I'm not a brick wall, we already discussed this in length in another thread which you are well aware of. That was not enough, you had to huff and puff to get an article written about it to flex your status like it's going to somehow change the view that other people already hold. You're not changing the minds of anyone who thinks in opposition of the way you do, this is just silly.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:44pm #32 nickerfoo
    Referenced post #31 by nya
    #29 I'm not a brick wall, we already discussed this in length in another thread which you are well aware of. That was not enough, you had to huff and puff to get an article written about it to... flex your status like it's going to somehow change the view that other people already hold. You're not changing the minds of anyone who thinks in opposition of the way you do, this is just silly.Read More
    #31

    Until you play the game in a competitive environment, you opinion is not supported.
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:49pm #33 LA-Riot
    i think the moloys are fine as they are i see so many ppl push threw the moloy and still rape leave the moloys alone
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:53pm #34 Dynastyy
    calling dazed
     / · 10.18.12 at 6:57pm #35 nya
    Referenced post #32 by nickerfoo
    #31

    Until you play the game in a competitive environment, you opinion is not supported.
    #32 I have plenty, I just don't care to get involved in ESEA, I'm 27 years old man, I'm not 16 anymore where this is all still fresh, new or relevant to me. The outlet in which you play the game doesn't matter if it's all structured the same.

    People on ESEA have this warped ideology that if you don't play on ESEA it somehow invalidates what you have to say. When OGL, TWL, TGL, CAL and CEVO were relevant people didn't play on ESEA but somehow we managed to play, the same goes on even now.

    This is not the only outlet to play the game, it's optional and this elitist mindset makes you look like some new guy who has never played anywhere else. You can find scrims or pug the game off client, it's not rocket science as it has never been.

    The fact of the matter is people do not all agree with Steel's PoV on the subject as they are free not to. He's one person and of no more importance than anyone else here, it's his opinion and it should be viewed as nothing more and nothing less.

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 7:00 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:05pm #36 esegay
    The fact that nya won't even meet half way and agree that molotov's need change assures me that he's never played against a team that knows how to use one. Let me guess, you're a pugstar that only play against people who use them the first 10 seconds of the round so they're easily avoided? Got ya.

    I proposed an idea in a thread similar to this, but it went un-noticed, so here goes.

    How about limiting molly's to 1 per team? It'll force teams to have to know what's going on around the map, rather than just chucking it based off of sounds/flashes and getting lucky. That will also open the door for fakes again, because if you succesfully make them use it while you're faking, then that means the other site will be easier to hit, b/c you know their molly has already been used.

    Just an idea. Either way, I agree with all your points steel. Remove it until we figure out ways to make it balanced for both T's and CT's. +1!
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:07pm #37 nya
    Referenced post #36 by esegay
    The fact that nya won't even meet half way and agree that molotov's need change assures me that he's never played against a team that knows how to use one. Let me guess, you're a... pugstar that only play against people who use them the first 10 seconds of the round so they're easily avoided? Got ya.

    I proposed an idea in a thread similar to this, but it went un-noticed, so here goes.

    How about limiting molly's to 1 per team? It'll force teams to have to know what's going on around the map, rather than just chucking it based off of sounds/flashes and getting lucky. That will also open the door for fakes again, because if you succesfully make them use it while you're faking, then that means the other site will be easier to hit, b/c you know their molly has already been used.

    Just an idea. Either way, I agree with all your points steel. Remove it until we figure out ways to make it balanced for both T's and CT's. +1!
    Read More
    #36 They have been severely nerfed since their first inception into the game, Steel even outlined that but somehow they are still "over powered". If people like him had their way they would nerf things like that into non-existence.
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:08pm #38 epocs
    molotovs shouldnt b allowed in scrims
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:08pm #39 zatRa
    they are getting annoying... maybe they can limit it to 2 per team?
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:18pm #40 esegay
    Referenced post #37 by nya
    #36 They have been severely nerfed since their first inception into the game, Steel even outlined that but somehow they are still "over powered". If people like him had their way they would... nerf things like that into non-existence.Read More
    #37 Finding the right balance takes time. Games don't come out of the box 'competition ready', it usually takes a long time to balance out everything just perfect. That being said, something with the molotov's is still lacking. Damage reduction and movement modification are 2 things mentioned in this post that could work. It's up for the community to decide.

    And I love how you say "People like him" as if he's a bad person for wanting to make competition as enjoyable / long-lasting as possible, rofl.

    It's people like YOU who need to keep their mouth shut. You don't even play ESEA, yet you're trying to decide what's best for it's community? HILARIOUS.

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 7:20 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:19pm #41 deviox
    Referenced post #37 by nya
    #36 They have been severely nerfed since their first inception into the game, Steel even outlined that but somehow they are still "over powered". If people like him had their way they would... nerf things like that into non-existence.Read More
    #37

    I'm still really curious as to why you post about the game, when you don't even scrim, or play in a league. What gives you any inclination to be giving advice about the game.
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:28pm #42 nickerfoo
    Referenced post #35 by nya
    #32 I have plenty, I just don't care to get involved in ESEA, I'm 27 years old man, I'm not 16 anymore where this is all still fresh, new or relevant to me. The outlet in which you... play the game doesn't matter if it's all structured the same.

    People on ESEA have this warped ideology that if you don't play on ESEA it somehow invalidates what you have to say. When OGL, TWL, TGL, CAL and CEVO were relevant people didn't play on ESEA but somehow we managed to play, the same goes on even now.

    This is not the only outlet to play the game, it's optional and this elitist mindset makes you look like some new guy who has never played anywhere else. You can find scrims or pug the game off client, it's not rocket science as it has never been.

    The fact of the matter is people do not all agree with Steel's PoV on the subject as they are free not to. He's one person and of no more importance than anyone else here, it's his opinion and it should be viewed as nothing more and nothing less.
    Read More
    #35

    Where in my sentence did I say the acronym ESEA?


    Oh, I didn't. You using your age as an excuse is also hilarious to me since you are one of the most active members on a video game forum, and pay to solely post on them.
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:32pm #43 nya
    Referenced post #40 by esegay
    #37 Finding the right balance takes time. Games don't come out of the box 'competition ready', it usually takes a long time to balance out everything just perfect. That being said,... something with the molotov's is still lacking. Damage reduction and movement modification are 2 things mentioned in this post that could work. It's up for the community to decide.

    And I love how you say "People like him" as if he's a bad person for wanting to make competition as enjoyable / long-lasting as possible, rofl.

    It's people like YOU who need to keep their mouth shut. You don't even play ESEA, yet you're trying to decide what's best for it's community? HILARIOUS.
    Read More
    #40
    Referenced post #41 by deviox
    #37

    I'm still really curious as to why you post about the game, when you don't even scrim, or play in a league. What gives you any inclination to be giving advice about the... game.Read More
    #41 Blah, blah, blah, "you don't play ESEA", typical closed minded morons I would expect from here.

    You're dumb, flat out dumb. This is an opinion based discussion, there is no right or wrong. My capacity for involvement in ESEA is completely irrelevant to this discussion as it's always been irrelevant for everything.

    Trying to use that as a means of discrediting my views and opinion is again, dumb. You're both new, should I use that to discredit you in some way? No, because that is fucking stupid.

    I understand that it takes time for things to be worked out but people around here are seem to be too fast to go from zero to removal of a game mechanic rather than looking for other means to compensate for it or solutions.

    I don't agree with them and no amount of bandwagoning and semi-pro player dick sucking is going to change that, as it's not going to change the mind of anyone else in opposition.

    This article if you can even call it that is nothing more than a peacock move to get one players view held above others and put the molotov in a publicly negative light.
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:36pm #44 esegay
    "Trying to use that as a means of discrediting my views and opinion is again, dumb."

    This is the only sentence I care about in your last post. You have yet to give us a reason as to why molly's should stay. Yet, you expect us to agree with your "VIEWS".

    Once you give us some solid reasoning I might agree with you, but until then, molly's are still overpowered IN MY OPINION.
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:38pm #45 nya
    Referenced post #42 by nickerfoo
    #35

    Where in my sentence did I say the acronym ESEA?


    Oh, I didn't. You using your age as an excuse is also hilarious to me since you are one of the most active... members on a video game forum, and pay to solely post on them.Read More
    #42 You insinuated it which is all that was needed, in terms of my age I was simply explaining, not excusing the fact that my involvement in all of this is slowly deteriorating.

    Referenced post #44 by esegay
    "Trying to use that as a means of discrediting my views and opinion is again, dumb."

    This is the only sentence I care about in your last post. You have yet to give us a reason... as to why molly's should stay. Yet, you expect us to agree with your "VIEWS".

    Once you give us some solid reasoning I might agree with you, but until then, molly's are still overpowered IN MY OPINION.
    Read More
    #44 I explained in detail in the other basically identical thread about molotov's wherever that may be. These guys are nothing more than a broken record who say the same shit over and over and over like a spoiled child whining until they get their way.

    5 threads about it don't work so they create an article, they are pushing their view until it is made a reality, this probably won't be the last thread about it either.

    Last modified on 10/18/2012 at 7:41 pm
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:40pm #46 rduBBz
    I approve this message
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:41pm #47 colt-
    so are sports analysts not allowed to talk about sports since they dont play the sports anymore?

    having 7 years of css knowledge and playing a bit of csgo is more than enough to formulate your own opinion on something.

    the argument "you dont play, your argument is invalid" is soooooo incredibly stupid, it makes me hang my head in shame that someone would actually use that as a point
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:41pm #48 nickerfoo
    Referenced post #45 by nya
    #42 You insinuated it which is all that was needed, in terms of my age I was simply explaining, not excusing the fact that my involvement in all of this is slowly deteriorating.

    #44 I... explained in detail in the other basically identical thread about molotov's wherever that may be. These guys are nothing more than a broken record who say the same shit over and over and over like a spoiled child whining until they get their way.

    5 threads about it don't work so they create an article, they are pushing their view until it is made a reality, this probably won't be the last thread about it either.
    Read More
    #45

    One, I did not insinuate anything. I said what I meant and meant what I said. You just infer implications which aren't there.

    Can this deteriorating process be catalyzed by something? If so, please let me know.
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:42pm #49 esegay
    Referenced post #45 by nya
    #42 You insinuated it which is all that was needed, in terms of my age I was simply explaining, not excusing the fact that my involvement in all of this is slowly deteriorating.

    #44 I... explained in detail in the other basically identical thread about molotov's wherever that may be. These guys are nothing more than a broken record who say the same shit over and over and over like a spoiled child whining until they get their way.

    5 threads about it don't work so they create an article, they are pushing their view until it is made a reality, this probably won't be the last thread about it either.
    Read More
    #45 Copy and paste it then. At this point you're coming off as someone who has no real arguement other than "JUST BECAUSE IT'S STEEL DOESN'T MEAN HIS OPINION IS VALID."

    Which can obviously be debated -- seeing has he's competed with/against some of the best teams in previous Counter Strike's
     / · 10.18.12 at 7:42pm #50 Koler
    approved.
    Load Page 2, comments 51 - 100 (50 total)
    Load Page 3, comments 101 - 150 (50 total)
    Load Page 4, comments 151 - 200 (50 total)
    Load Page 5, comments 201 - 250 (50 total)
    Load Page 6, comments 251 - 300 (50 total)
    Load Page 7, comments 301 - 350 (50 total)
    Load Page 8, comments 351 - 357 (7 total)
    Post a Comment
    You must have an ESEA account and be signed in to post a reply.